#017 - How to Create Real Impact in Interior Design (2/2) — House-Coaching Expert Sisi Salamanca asks Marc Müskens

This episode is all about inspiring and empowering you as an interior designer. It’s about enhancing your skills, expanding your creative horizons, and revolutionize your approach to design.

1. How can you unleash your creativity to create awe-inspiring spaces?
2. What are the secrets to collaborating seamlessly with clients?
3. How can you strike the perfect balance between aesthetics and functionality?
4. What can you do to turn design challenges into triumphs?
5. How do you embrace diverse design preferences for breathtaking results?
6. How can you measure the impact your designs have on people's lives?
7. How can you create healing environments that nurture well-being?
8. How can you empower individuals through your design choices?
9. How do you infuse emotional depth and purpose into your projects?
10. How can you design spaces that evoke a deep sense of personal meaning?

Link:
https://instituteofinteriorimpact.com/sisi

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Transcript

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this is part two of a two-part interview between CeCe Salamanca and Mark muskins part one is also available in our Beyond interior design podcast

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and it's funny because what I see is that when you offer only interior design most people are willing to pay without having that value like people are are willing to pay for an interior a beautiful project of interior design not getting anything personally or fulfilling or just a beautiful space and they are willing to pay that money so it has to be better if you if you are if you offer this value of improving your your way of living and your relationships and your your purpose in life it has to be more it has to be easier right yeah but the funny thing is not everybody wants a good entire design sometimes you meet people that don't care about entire desire in the world most of the time you say I don't know how it is with you but every time I said in my life hey what is it that you're doing I'm a material designer and say oh well nice wow great lovely amazing it's it's never like oh what is that kind of that's a dull profession that's boring and I I met I met once in my life I met a guy who said oh I didn't oh oh that's boring yeah I was so interested because we it's not that ever [Music]

he said but they don't know first they don't know but some people are really happy and just uh well let's go to the brick bunker or they don't need all this things and or they don't they're not looking for a higher purpose they are just happy they're happy don't you can wake them up and maybe they they will wake up and they say hey there could be more in my life than just did I I don't agree with that I I totally think that everybody needs it everybody yeah even if you don't have money even if you don't have a purpose but the the the power that you can actually change the mindset of someone with with just a few painting and painting a wall and adding some pictures and maybe some wallpaper and very little change but it's I I the way I see it with with house coaching is a is a way of of self-knowledge you know like it's a very powerful tool to to know who you are where you're going where your dreams your passions who doesn't need that well let's say if the people the people that are looking for that those are your ideal clients yeah people that are looking for the higher purpose in entire design they don't want this beautiful stuff and that's it they those are your ideal clients so don't focus on the people if you're looking at the at the business business perspective don't try to convince clients that don't care about this higher purpose because then your business is really heavy that's true yeah if you say hey I love bicycling every day and here and you are offering them a car they said I hate the car yeah no no no take the bike it's much it's a take to the car because it's much better you you're going faster you uh when it's raining you are you are dry and uh you know and there are electric cars by the way so it's not uh it's good for the planet or whatever you can convince them but they are so happy on the bike so this is this is this is not your client that's true um one of the things that I wanted to ask you and and you mentioned something about that is when I when I coach interior designers sometimes they they talk to me about um the fear yeah of losing well there are a lot of fears but this one especially of of losing their signature because it's supposed to you as a designer have to leave a signature in every project and you have to be recognized for it and um the profession expects you to to have a certain signature and be known by it and when we coach when we do how when we do house coaching we have to get rid of that somehow because the interest is in the client you need to to focus on the on the clients needs and and really connect and be very generous about it so how do you manage that how do you keep them from feeling fearful about leaving their signature and actually taking care of their clients well I think when you mentioned fear I was like oh yes the Imposter syndrome that a lot of designers are facing so let me let me if it's okay with you let me talk about that first because yeah fear of having principles and and and well people that want to try to avoid them or you need to ignore them that's that's another thing for a lot of designers they I told them they want they have the best intentions but the most designers I think I'm not good enough I'm not the best interior designer yet I always like to place yats maybe behind because that will change already your mindset but what what is it is it if if you think I'm not I'm not good enough as a designer and a lot of creators do have that it's how hard is it to start to get your story into the world when you think who and who am I it's for me it's a kind of excuse to stay small and that's really safe and really comfortable because you will have some easy nice clients and you can you can do whatever you like and it's okay you are designing and you have some projects once in a while but if you really have a message to share you you just have to tell yourself hey I am good enough right now and now we have those perfectionism because we are aesthetic people we are working with visual we are those yeah we are perfectionists so the the thing is um

well I don't know I don't know where where it's it's coming from because what what we what would be perfect you know it's not perfect there's no perfect what what is perfect you have something you want to achieve you are you have you have your own dreams you want to build something with your own with your business uh that really excites you and that that that's a great driving force to to start your business and to continue with your business every day like hey I want to have this those I want to touch that higher Purpose with my clients but if you think I'm not good enough so I'm always like hey what what if now would be the right moment to step up and start thinking like hey I'm just going to build I just take what really helps me is I'm just taking the first Next Step otherwise it's kind of I see swam in the chat here perfectionism is just another word for postponing because that's what you're doing with perfectionism I think it definitely comes from from our education system because um we are we are trained to have a an external verification of who we are of how how are we measured like if we if we are good or not is something external that is supposed to tell us if you're good or not and that's how they educate us from from four years old to where we graduate from college yeah and then we come into the profession so we are looking for the quality for the for the grade from the client from the you know we're looking for it but we don't get it so it's kind of um it's kind of it's scary right so what we do in in the house coaching Institute the first coaching we have is is actually being our own measurement in in in in in terms of uh strengths and and what what what I want to be who I want to be how my life is is good for me not external um um I don't know how to say it but uh how to measure and and that's my next question maybe for you is about success success is a is a concept that we learned also from education from the education system that success is when your teacher gives you an a yeah right yeah and in the business World maybe how much money you make uh or that's the way success is is measured and that has a huge impact on our purpose because sometimes I me myself right now I feel the most successful woman in the world but for some people I'm not yeah but mindset mindset is everything but think about it when you have something beautiful to share with the world some Mentor told me because I took a lot of trainings together with Trend we we spend over one well hundred thousand dollars in total the last few years on trainings because well we always say the biggest projects that's you that's yourself so work on that one but it's see it this way that is really this you're really selfish if you keep your knowledge and your expertise and your love and your everything you have to offer to the world and you keep it for yourself it's selfish you are this serving people in the world you have something to share and because you think it's not perfect enough I'm not good enough you don't do it so think about it this way look in the mirror and think about what because you are a perfectionist you are postponing all the great stuff what it is that you keep for yourself what you're not sharing because we all want to share but maybe it can make you feel horrible and that could be a a breakthrough in your mindset to just think to decide right now what I have in my mind my dreams my desires what I want to build with my design office I'm just starting right after this podcast sorry with um with what I like to do for years with my dreams just start with the first next step to build depth what do you think we have an Institute right now with a with one of the biggest Global communities on LinkedIn beyond the terror design and what what would happen if I thought two years ago because it we just started two years ago what would happen if we thought well we're just when an eye who are we we're just military designers from the Netherlands and nobody knows us and uh well let's keep this system for ourselves and who can benefit from that and well who wants to listen to us and an Institute uh hell no why well no you you you need to build an Institute when you're when you already died then they they will get an Institute or as most of the time is with artists when you die you earn the most of money because then your picture or your entire designs are value the most but if you think about it we never started the Institute if we thought so small and if we were acting like a perfectionist well then we couldn't create those steps where we what we did right now we never could yeah so how do you how do you do that in your Institute how do you deal with perfectionism and the feeling of not being good enough with your students how do you do that um well like I said take the first Next Step because we are getting I'm getting scared too uh sometimes from the really big goals if you told me hey you're going to build an Institute or you don't uh you're going to do a podcast it's it's it's heavy could be Heavy in your mind because you you make it so big or like hey when I have that uh awesome premium paying client um well maybe that scares you but what is the first step you think you need to do to connect with those people or to just take every time create chinks of the journey if you're focusing on every time on the end goal you wake up it can be your your driving force that you want to create something bigger than yourself but don't if it scares you you're going in the wrong direction because then you don't act on that mm-hmm so yeah make really small chinks of it every step you need to take in order to achieve your dreams right one of the things that worked for us because we had the same the same thought like we we are a group of women from Colombia and Denmark and we wanted to build this multinational Institute don't smile you're serious about it I know it I am serious I'm happy about it yeah because we are we are now we are now we are that's why we buy weather because we are we are visible enough so we found each other and I'm in Colombia you're in in the Netherlands so it's it's happening and it's working and the way we we decided to approach it and I guess uh it I think it was a good way to do it because I struggled with the same thing in in our in my coaching with the designers every day when they face their clients and they feel they're not good enough and they get scared and we connecting to your strengths is something that actually works very fast when you know what you're good at like you do very well with other people and that's your signature that's how I see it when you know clearly what you what you're good at and but those are the those are then you are already confident about skills you have and you're good at but it's about the things that you that you think I'm lacking off being a good leader communicating really well I'm not the best designer those are the the the the the thresholds that's true yeah so it's great to to remind of your unique powers and unique potential but the things that that are scary are the things that you think I'm not good enough so you can start there's another principle that came up it's the 80 20 rule just do things and it's scary the first time it's really scary do things for 80 percent it's like I you want to to to make it perfect but that's 100 but just stop at 80 and maybe the first time you think this is 80 and you're already 98. and then the first time you you get better at it but just see what's going on when you create things for eighty percent they just think okay it's good it's good for now keep yourself in that thing because when you're too much in your head well sometimes you say when you're in your hat you're dead then you you don't create yeah and why wait where you can create that's always I like always this one one liner why wait when you can create we have so much idea so so experience the beauty of starting with something and then you will your brain will tell you hey I like this I started and I got my achievements I got fulfillment for the day for that for that single step the chunk that activity and you can do it again and you can do it again and your mind will get used to it like hey let's let's do that uncomfortable small step today let's start with it and every time that's the the well it's progress equals happiness that's most of the time if you're feeling you are growing and you're doing the good stuff that equals happiness so so try that it's you could say you're like um with a with a with a cannon it's like um um how do you say it ready aim fire that's what that's what they say yes something that is ready aim for in that order but let's change the order to um

and then you are ready yeah it's a scary concept yes I was going to mention something that we have experienced as well and maybe maybe it's easier sometimes for us is uh recognizing I'm I'm vulnerable in this situation that I I don't know at all I I'm not the best yeah but um but I'm very good at this other thing that I do it very well and sometimes we get people who are very well in in what I'm not and we get together and that's something else that has worked very well that I we have house coaches that are not designers they are training in in their coaches for instance and they want to to use interior design as a tool for human development and growth and and they they are not the best in interior design but they are very good coaches yeah so they they get together with the with an interior design with our architect we an interior designer or an architect and they team up and that's the best result yeah wonderful strategy do what you love to do most and what you're good at if you focus on that one and uh yes at school and in our careers we learn to upgrade the the the the figures that are not good if you are not good at math at school what do they do they put you in at mod extra classes or biology or whatever if you don't like science you've got extra lessons of science because your number needs to race you need to get that A or B at least and that's that's wrong with the system and that's where that perfectionism is coming I need to be good and dairy designer and an entrepreneur and I need to good with surfaces and floor planning and technology and lights and oh wait there's materials and I need to get I need to know all the brands and I need to uh well I need to to to to to to to buy them and I need to fix it and I need to do the construction work and I need to guide the whole process okay how much are you looking forward to a new project exactly it's overwhelming and it's impossible and then you up of course you feel like you're not good enough because it's it's very very it's too much yeah and then you're trying then you you're trying and that trying just too good you know you know what what the slogan of night right

uh just do it yeah and it's not let's try it right let's do it that should be a lazy slogan from Nike let's well let's try it no you're doing it or not don't try things right yeah so go go full in you know you know your own purpose and me you know what you love do more of what you love yeah that's how this podcast came from the ground I was like hey I like to talk with other professionals worldwide about my profession let's start and then well we almost at the episode 17 or so yeah and we have thousands of downloads so who know who who knew that there was not even a plan to start a podcast but I just did what I what I love to do and other people love it too obviously I'm glad for that yeah so it's 80 mindset and 20 skills that's that's what we what we teach at The Institute I love that I love that so don't don't try to be a better designer but but try to focus on the Beyond part yeah that's real life that's also some thing that I I take from coaching you know like um uh you can be T you can be taught some skills but coaching brings the best of you out you know like coaching is is a way of of remembering what I'm about what is it that I do that I'm really good at and my my nature and if you mix that with your skills is the best the best you can do yeah I like to bring it up really because you are with the house coaching Institute you you have to take that to the surface because that's what you're really selling your Golden House coaching Institute but if you're an entire designer you love this Beyond layer or this those deeper layer whatever you call it you need to to do it really subtle that you every time you are educating your clients why it is what you are doing and why they hired you and every time you need to remind your client that hey look why do you want to change this in your design why why do you come up with this idea where does it come from I think it's a beautiful idea but why why do we do you want the closet with diagonal lines yes or yesterday in a restaurant and I really love it okay but what is the purpose do you think you are going to love it tomorrow or next year what's what's the meaning for you from this concept how does it elevate your life in a way is this it's a story solution yes but this design what what is it did you always like the design that way no no just no no no or like they went to Ibiza and everything and the next time I I give this example in the podcast last uh last time they went to Ibiza and they are from the whites and turquoise and wrote down okay get back what's the goal with this do you want to live it in for years go back to the to the higher to the higher purpose of the design and every time we when you are referring to that higher level you are raising the value of the profession and you are really delivering impact because they know what you did and when you finished your projects people will think about the designer about the consultant or whatever the coach who helped them with achieving that result and they they they have more meaning you added a lot of meaning and if you add more meaning you can make more impact that's our strategy add more meaning to make more impacts right I I have a question about that because I I want our house coaches to listen to you talking about it

um you know this this concept of of productivity that we still have in our heads like um how do we we have a new generation of people like Millennials and and and the ones younger than those that are definitely looking for purpose more than than money and they are they are driven by other things and and freedom in their work and a lot of you know they want different kind of jobs so how would you sell this different way of doing interior design to those people how would you communicate what we do uh how to inspire young people to follow this path and not the productivity path because I've been asked every time I talk about house coaching the first thing that comes to mind is how much money you make and how many students do you graduate each year it's all about numbers and productivity nobody asked me how sustainable is my business how happy my people are how happy my clients are you know I wish they did but they don't no how would you approach that well I think the new generation is is looking for this higher purpose and a lot of people do because but somebody some people will Discover it when they are 20 30 right now 40 even 50 60 whatever it's going on right now it's a kind of reset that's going on that people think well maybe there's always a time to to switch my lifestyle to switch my career because otherwise when I die tomorrow I'm not fulfilled so the first thing is they need to know what the purpose is and it's it's maybe you don't want to hear this but in some way they are like our clients because most of the clients they know what they don't want and they can tell you to give you a long list I don't like this I don't want that okay what is it that you want and sometimes they literally don't know they don't have a Clear Vision on what they really want so you need to help them I think we need to help them to guide them to to see what it is that they really want because when you have that Clarity we always say Clarity is power then you know your direction at least you can measure if there are coming new things on your path is this in line with my higher purpose or not it's easier to choose and there are so many choices right now in the world you can choose literally everything in the world that's another problem yeah it's not like you choose your career for 25 50 years and that's it you're settled for life and they like they do like money they like money because they can they can do it they can do a lot of with money why not but if you need a quality life you need quality questions that's really one of the mentors told me that one and it's always about asking the right questions again that's why I mentioned the the clients you they need to know what is it what is their purpose what is it so um most of the time we're looking for answers but actually you need to know if you need to look for the right questions what to ask yeah you need to write questions instead of the right answers because how is really frustrating that's always the next question how do we do that yeah how is really frustrating but if you know the why you want to do it the hour is much easier

right yeah so always go back go back to the why and you can do the same with your clients ask them why do you want that Why seven times y you see what's going on just test it with your kids or test it with family members or friends you see what's going on or ask yourself write something now why is it that I'm in my business I want to hear I want to help uh I'm crazy about the terror design okay why are you crazy about the tarot design well um I see what it can do with other people's lives why do you want to see a lot of people watch interior design is for their lives well because of okay why why why why and you will see you will touch the kind of depth a level that is you can communicate that one to your clients and you are touching the Beyond level so easy but that's it's all about the question if you're not able to do it for yourself um let's do this exercise with somebody else let somebody else ask you the question you know in your group or with your members are following just plan a session for that and to see what's what's going on but you know and you but it's it's hard to communicate it right what's in your heart sometimes you have this business talk you know what we we you know what we use for that and there's a tool that we use that is called the mirror of cell

for a piece of furniture or with a with a an accessory or something because sometimes people are very afraid of talking about how they feel and especially when you talk about relationships or uh going through a divorce or something difficult in their lives so we we use a piece of furniture and we asked them if they wear that piece of furniture how would they feel mm-hmm so it's a very useful way of asking about their feelings without asking them directly and it's very useful I remember one one time asking a guy that of course guys have more struggle talking about emotions oh yeah I don't know it's well it's definitely a cultural thing but I think about depending on where you live in the world but most of the time let's say that's the case yes not all men but some men are a little shy talking about emotions so there was a TV in the space and we asked him um how would you feel if you were that TV because he hated it I hated TV I I hate it how would you feel and the guy said what what do you want from me I'm just a TV and that was exactly what he was feeling you know in his life her his husband his wife was asking too much of him yeah what do you want from here just a TV I'm just here in the wall well I I for sure it will will uh we'll give you some some crazy scenarios with with clients if you if you acted with it this way it I think it might have been it every everybody is different so you can use different strategies to to get to the level you want right somebody if you I can imagine some of my clients when I when I tell them to listen to what the chair is telling them they are like okay I made the right choice no I'm not in the right place no this is not a designer for me no it's not worthy Investments that you are going the wrong direction but there are stories I uh there is one podcast mirror mirror on the wall and we share that in depth in our training and a woman is talking about a mirror and we ask her why is this mirror important well I will not share the whole story in this podcast but you see where you can end up with just a mirror and that's exactly that's so cool the mirror was talking to us and was telling the whole story of her life and you could think as a designer this mirror this is the mirror yes the mirror why does she want to take it so badly in a new house and you can say well it doesn't fit it's not aligned with it who are you because this was the meaning this was setting the whole stage the whole all the principles and all the design rules were based on the mirror for the rest of the story so I I don't think she knew that but as a designer we knew enough to of course but not every design can get that you know like when you need to be a little attuned and and maybe brave enough and have the courage to to to see the person behind the mirror just tell them I'm really curious I think it's the best it's the best uh um

I think the best interior designs are really curious you just tell your client like that I'm really curious I think it's the best skill for an entire design to be curious tell me why why is that I think in in our personal mentorship uh ships we have a lot of most of the problems that designers are facing in there process are about assuming what they were telling they say uh yeah I asked him or her twice or three times why it is but then they continue their design process and they just take on the last answer but it's not finished and and then they are angry about that the client wants another version why it's it's not good and he told me that they want it this way and now we I said why how did you how did you do that how much Clarity did you got on on your next version that you need exactly what to do why you do why you did that can you explain the client why you made this design yeah they told me to change that into that why yeah I don't know but they wanted I was fed up with it and I just did it okay a few hours later a few hours spent wrong bad relationship with your clients yeah right that I've seen that also and some interior designers struggling so much with many hours investing invested in in the renders and the

shopping and everything they get to the client the client is this is not what I want and it's it's totally because they are so much in their head and they don't connect with the with their their needs where the clients needs Maybe yeah we've seen that a lot it's a it's a spiritual game business huh it is yeah it's it's a spiritual game but let's let's uh we we are uh well we are we have a we talked we talked a lot already I I have the principal still wrote written down like uh like the signature do you want do you want to know more about that is it or do you have a I think I think I would like to know if if people have questions I don't know if if in the if if there are some questions because that would be good to answer them yeah well my in my idea because we have um um we have uh some questions open that I really want to answer for you because you sent me the question I'm really like okay now I want to deliver your your the questions of your following uh we have an opportunity to send uh questions to us to The Institute uh so we can create a follow-up on that one okay that's cool because I see a lot going on in the chat and swen is uh communicating with them and then sometimes I'm just speaking in the chat like hey what what is what is going on here I was curious I am curious about it that's why I asked yeah we are saving the chat for sure we are saving it and we filter the question and we we uh would love to get back on that uh on that one yeah okay so uh please feel free to uh direct message me or to send an email to The Institute of Ontario impact um we also have a blueprint for you available uh if you go to Beyond interior design dot Club is dot Club there is a blueprint um for sure it starts with asking the right questions and how to assess with your client where we where we talked about before and that's why I said about this this principle CC if I can uh if I can get to that because um you ask me some sometimes you have to deviate from your own design religion or principles yeah for sure yeah that that could be a problem right client that asks you like hey um I I I want it this way do you have some reason to say no to you and you know by Art like oh no this is this is the best for them how do how do we handle that yeah in my opinion there are that's what you call uh you could call that a signature yeah but in my uh well in in our world we we are kind of dealing with two signatures it's a signature level uh based on their static level so um you could be a designer with a really specific style yeah with a with almost the same energy every time the same Vibe or atmosphere you're creating so um no matter for who it is or for whom no matter every time you create almost this the same kind of kind of design that that's possible there's not nothing wrong with that there is a business level there's a great market for this a lot of designers do have this signature they just sell it every time people want this they get that easy as it is so um you can choose that one but I think you love more the other level of the signature because yes custom-made the stuff every time because then we know and we truly believe that will get the people the results in the impact level we want to achieve that we'll give the the ultimate fulfillment so that's what we call the the principal level you can call it that one so one is the static level and the second one is the principal level and that's the kind of um we teach that at one of our trainings and that's the kind of set of design rules you are communicating you can call it your uh Your Design religion if you want

the the your principles that you're using in order to achieve the best result for your clients and that's that can be a kind of proof for your client the kind of uh manual that you can show them up front so I'm talking about the first live meeting for example that you want to have the view [Music] want to know how are you going to do that how are you going to guide us to get there and that's where it's like uh some rules that that uh that you follow in your work yeah yeah okay it's really it's not about the the this is going to be pretty not the aesthetic level but really the kind of designers what what kind of game rules design and rules you're you're doing every time because you know it's going to be successful and if you can show them that you have kind of proof with your projects um it's hard for people to say no to that because then it's their risk they it's magical when you communicate that that's uh we call it that we have 11 of those principles we call it our heaven 11. because it's when we came up with those 11 it was Heaven people were like okay if if that's the way you we're going to achieve that result um okay I'm in I do understand that and we're like whoa no no nose anymore no no no no no next design version they could follow us so it's all about communicating but the client could follow us what we were doing in the design process so um it's no rocket side because um well what's um we have a one of the principles is I think it's on a block on the on the website as well one of our principles is uh tidy and lazy and we make them exciting and lazy and it it it's tells your client actually everybody wants to be tidy and everybody wants to be lazy yeah so that is like how are we going to do that yes that's the ideal world this is heaven tidy and lazy yeah I want that so if you're selling Home Solutions like you have really good Storage Solutions or you are a designer that focuses on creating new habits in order to storage stuff or do gone back home with your jacket and your coat and it's every it's designed to for those processes you can explain it to your clients and if your ideal client love those things they want the Tidy home and they want to be lazy they want to spend less time on tidying up and cleaning they are fond of the rule so if they know every solution you're designing for them is in line with us principles why should they argue with you on that on on a on a wardrobe or closet or custom-made Furniture yeah they can only argue when it's not giving them the results when the design is back I was thinking about our clients with house coaching and sometimes I'm thinking this this deals with uncertainty with for the client right like giving them a a map route somehow because sometimes people get scared when they don't know what's gonna happen and you go into their homes and start asking questions and and asking about feelings and stuff yeah yeah this is a good way of of uh lowering that that fear yes definitely So you you're communicating this upfront doing the design every time you're repeating it because they they wanted to work with you because you told them this is how I do it and if they see the whole trajectory that you are sticking to those rules in this design religion not a signature not only Aesthetics you can do that but but they will they they know for sure if you're from the neutral colors and you're adding red or yellow and blue and one design version they are like what is he or she doing then it's then you have another problem maybe but now they know why are you doing what you're doing so you communicate upfront during and after the process even after just show them at the end result how it supported their life and how it was uh how the the religion you are having 11 your your principles are um activating activated in the design that they can show hey yes you talk about that now you can see it now you can see how this works that's a really cool story to tell to other people that you work that way it's all about the risk they have no risk anymore they know we are crazy people we are dreamers we are we are all over the place in our ads with our ideas so they we are a different species right um

there's a lot of here on here yeah so you create a win-win that's the most that's the best scenario and you you will do that with with guiding them taking their hand take the leads and show them this is how we're going to do it and if you do that up front not acting like an interro designer but acting like a design guide or whatever and you show them this is what we're going to face I know this because it's my expertise this is what we're going to face and this is how we are going to solve it and why are we doing what we're doing right now this is the impact we would like to make together right do we agree on that one and it's almost like they fill out the signature on your sales page and not on your principal page it's the same moment they agree on everything they heard from you and they are like okay please take me on the journey tell me what to do next Mark yeah that's a very I think it's very useful for us um yeah definitely speaking Yeah I was thinking um sometimes we we face very difficult these situations you know with our clients that nobody wants to talk about you know like we go into their homes and there's an elephant in the room and nobody wants to talk about it like for instance with couples that happens a lot yeah that you go into the room and you see a room that is decorated but by somebody sometimes the woman sometimes the guy but you can see that is not a a couple's room and you want to talk about that but the so one of them says that has nothing to do with me you just you do that and I won't take part of it but it's an issue you can see that it's an issue some of them one of them is not feeling at home yeah or they say I don't care about that and then then it's funny first I was scared of that and now we almost always making fun of that that we just show them a pink wall for example if they hate pink they just told us I I hate green or pink or blue whatever and we just showed him a color well

any process because you don't want to spend weeks on designing and then trying to test that that's not the most ideal way you can do it in a session so you just tell them oh so yeah if we click on that one and we just change it for pink you are agree with that one you're like no you make well you might you can don't take the we are so serious about our profession most of the time but you can you can add a lot of fun in the process and even with those marriages and couples most of the time you see why they love each other and I love to acknowledge that every time let's see hey I know why you love him or I can see that because you're this is your world and this is your world and you're both attracted here's here's the match and if you are able to do not compromise design but you're able to combine those worlds to well that they that they uh lift each other up or they they are going to be a better person because the design reminds them of who they can be what they are it's that that's that's amazing though I you use the game of the marriage that is not Goods maybe I do hope it's good because otherwise you have two uh two clients we we did over 400 projects and only one field because the Merit was horrible so the a few months later they uh divorced we're like okay that was the problem we had two clients one home right we deal with that a lot and a lot of guys try to get out of the project because they say I I don't mind you do whatever you want and and I'll deal with it and at the end the the result is that he doesn't feel at home definitely he doesn't feel good because he didn't participate in any of their decisions so we we have a tool and we work on that and and it's it's it's we've we've had some amazing uh results about that but how would you approach um well actually you already answered that like if you if you if you show them the result yeah those those guys who don't want to participate but if you show them what can they what they can achieve if they participate because they don't know no that's that's it the interior design is for them like a kind of Hobby and the entire designer likes it and their wife likes it maybe or their partner and they are like okay if this is not for me just uh do your thing uh yes here's my money maybe but I'm not well I'm not really into this unless you educate them

and you show them the pink wall yeah you now well that's what that's for the fun to to to uh create a participation yeah I want to participate everybody needs participate the whole family we even have uh questionnaires for the children in the in the families and it's true yeah it's lovely right as young as three three yeah yeah yeah it's so it's so important to to put them in they have another emotions with changing homes and room so yeah everybody needs to join and if you're not if you do have a client uh where not everybody wants to participate you have to think about is this a good client right because you end up with well at least some one of them is well could be not be as satisfied as you not happy yeah yeah we do the same thing I think it's very important to if you're if you're working with a family and that's something that we have we have seen as well you're working with a family room and you're not taking into account every single member of the family it's not going to be a family room yeah if if only one of of them is making decisions yeah yeah so I I wanted to ask you just one more question I don't know we're hour of time but I wanna I make the question uh is about how do you measure uh success in your projects so how do you know if your project was successful yeah well um you said it before they ask people ask for numbers when uh you have when they uh yeah ask for your business but at a home or or whatever it's hard to measure if the design is doing what it has to do but success is it has to do with the Fulfillment with the happiness level if they feel if they open their eyes every day and they feel so empowered by the design then you could say you did it then it's successful if they think after a few years I want to change my entire design there could be something else going on in their lives that they want to change but in general the basics should be okay we have some clients in 2008 they still have the same living room and they are on the high high end level they are in the we have a quote list of the most richest people in the in the Netherlands they were just below the top 40. but they still have the same living room I think that's for me yeah that it is successful because how many got influenced by other trans friends people so um it's you could say it's when it's adding value to the world if you get it to a higher perspective and you talk about showing New Perspectives to people about interior design if you educate them on sustainability about this happiness and and fulfillment it's um

well our motto is living on your own terms maybe it has to do with that living on your own terms is what we have on the headline of our with our own design company and everybody has their own terms but so if you're living on your own terms if you're happy in a complete gray house or black bathroom or whatever yeah that's these are your terms and when that works for you then uh then it works so if you if you if you can maybe you can if you know it for yourself because that's important again you can teach other people but if you don't know if you're not living it if you're not living your best life or you are not happy it's hard to try to make somebody else happy so living on your own turns for us means um I can live or work where I want with who I want and when I want that's a kind of ultimate scenario and every time when I touch that kind of Freedom level the freedom of choice I'm so happy I'm like oh I could choose I don't have to do this I can do that yeah yeah so that's that's for me the ultimate success if I have that that kind of standards and if you're talking about debts to clients and they are they have Ambitions to have a design like that so their home will make their life noticeably easier then you are on the same page you know hey I know he's on the he's on the same thing okay yeah wonderful that's amazing yeah the the way we solve that or the way we approach that with house coaching is we always set up um an emotional purpose for the project yeah that we need to fulfill an emotional need so so give me an example what what could be the example yeah and a very very common example is uh a lot of women dedicate their lives to their children their husband their home the and they are totally homeless in their home they don't have a space they they don't know what to sit because the this is the kids this is the my husband where do I go where do I sit maybe the kitchen but not all day some only part part time of the day so they are totally homeless so that that uh purpose that uh emotional purpose would be to find yourself again in your home who you are what you like what you love as an individual not as a mom not as a wife not as a housewife no but as a person as an individual and that would be the emotional purpose of the project how do you achieve that that the whole project is going to be find a place even if it's a little corner somewhere it doesn't matter it doesn't have to be big you don't have to have your own home your own room and if you achieve that through the through the project we feel successful so actually you're talking about place and maybe maybe you will you will love this because first we always ask what is your favorite place the house your favorite spot or where do you spend the most of your time yeah but if you're literally really a logical answer could be the bathroom because I spent there eight hours if you're lucky yeah but is it that you want to focus on the bathroom no yeah so what's your favorite spot it could be well I love to sit at the bar of the the dining bar or whatever but if you ask a question what's your favorite moment of the week and that's our magical question always what's your favorite moment of the week you get the question you love you want because then you know which moment do they value the most and if it's talking about me time like you give the example of the women she doesn't know her place she doesn't have her own space or moments because it's you could have your own chair if you see logical you can give her the chair as you want but then all everybody is asking her questions as you need to do all kinds of stuff what she feels you need to do something you didn't design the space well so how can you create her moment what does she need for that some people they have a lot of money and they they would like to have Indian buffalo ladder with whatever in a complete windowsill for 30k for a just seat and other people just say no I just take the chair I put it in front of the window I'm looking outside to the cell with my cup of espresso and every day when I have those four minutes of Peace before everybody's entering my house I'm so happy so let's design that moment there's one place you need to design to make it successful if you talk about success a measurement maybe this isn't a concrete example yes design that moment and it's wonderful and for the rest it could be wonderful and nice too but this will stick in their hats and hearts they will remember you every time when they sit on the chair and drink the espresso they're like wow they did a good job yeah the Italian designer did a good job yeah so but the most important thing is we do have very good intentions for our clients but sometimes interro designs are too good too good literally they say oh well I don't need I don't want to earn more I don't need more money I don't I just do it for my clients but start with yourself and they are so busy the most prepared excuses that we hear on LinkedIn on conversations in calls I am too busy it's like it's it we glorify being busy yeah and that's so bad because busy is not a good thing in my opinion no you don't have the creative freedom you don't spend the time with your loved ones as you would love to uh maybe hell to something sleep is a magical thing there are so many important things to write get to your potential so I'm too busy it's a really bad one the bad sign is a bad sign that you're not going the right direction right so if you're talking about meaning and purpose you have to think about when this is your excuse most of the time to grow or to go to the next level or to go whatever you call it whatever you like to achieve and you have to excuse I'm too busy or you're busy with the wrong stuff think think again yep I we actually start when we do the the certification the program we start with their own spaces and and we found that funny enough designers have terrible spaces where they work and where they live yeah that's how they treat that's how they treat themselves exactly that's not okay that's not okay no it's like um we have a lot of we have a lot of on on our plate yeah we have a lot of outlets all kinds of things we would like to do and like to achieve and you see the whole place but the question is do you want to eat all of that and and how good does it do to you what is the question do you want to eat all of it what it's right now on your plates yes or no

what's the answer Cece no I I mean I I choose only the things that give me energy back you know like the ones who the the the the the tasks that return some give me something in return I don't give away just for giving away if if I don't get something back and it doesn't have to be money it doesn't have to be time but it has to be uh motivation and happiness and fulfillment uh if I do things that don't give me that I just stop doing them yeah but I hear you talking about the money part yeah money is is something that is very important why yeah why why um no actually actually money is in the base I would say in the base of the pyramid we need money in order to have a a the life that we want to have yeah and that is very individual very subjective I would say for each person money can buy you happiness but it yes them makes life really easy and how how much there are some romantic people like oh I'm I I don't need that amount of money because my lifestyle is okay and then they have this ambition to uh help the whole worlds right and then it's like hey what if it could give you 10 million right now how much people do you think you can help with your expertise with your dreams your higher to achieve your higher purpose how would 100 000 people can help 100 000 people can help you to go in the right direction and then you are like yes thank you give me a hundred thousand yes thank you would you that's what I mean I think it's a is a combination it's definitely the combination yes money is money is the results money is always the result it's not the goal it's a result yes yes and it's always uh we are we are thinking about that in our in our Institute as well because now we have it ready to go out into the world and grow and multiply you know and we need money for that that's the only way we can do it but I think it's a is a combination of growing and supporting we we don't want to grow in in a way that we lose our lives and we are so busy that we cannot even enjoy our our work you know like we can find someone or I think you are in a very if I look back and I told you about the example that we have 16 projects at the same time uh at that time it was not a good moment but I when that it was a luxury problem so if you're talking about I don't want to that the business that you are already afraid that your business is growing too big that will never happen because you you will be so in touch with your with your business it can't it can't happen it's almost Unthinkable that this would happen that you're not in touch in connection with your business please try to build a business that it's unmanageable for you because it's so big because they even know for sure you did a good job if you have so many clients lined up with your entire design firm or Institute or whatever right and you can use you have other problems and they are really easy to solve okay good good clear clear yeah that's a lovely situation to be in that's a good problem to have that's a lovely wonderful problem yeah okay yeah we will have that problem pretty soon I assure you we are we are designers so design your life yeah reshape your life if you're not happy right now with your life reshape it yeah you can design your life too so so if you think about with your dreams like I wish I had those clients I wish I had those big projects yes you can but you need to reshape your business design your business design your life in order to get that so Play Arts work smart and work on yourself invest in yourself

sounds good yeah is it and it's all about serving and growing and giving yes I I want to address that I want to address that because that's that's something that we they don't ask they don't teach us that as well in in school or or or universities when you find a way of serving people that's another level of of your profession and your life and your when you find that is is self-developing you know like it's it's it grows by itself yeah but how much impact can you make when you don't know how to surf and sell on people right it's it's step by step yes so make sure you know how to surf and sell yourself your business your services in order to touch all those lives otherwise you have you it you can talk about creating impacts but you're not making it back because she stays small yeah it's Greater Life you can't wake up to that's it right yeah yeah

well CeCe okay so this was amazing thank you so much thank you so much you too for for taking my word on on my proposal yeah no of course I I loved it and first a big hands for all the people that are still here yes thank you so much for joining us yeah thank you for joining us yeah well a CEO thank you for the sassy is also already some great gums for the people that left us um in the in the podcast with a big thank yous and insights and uh we will continue with that so maybe when we have more questions when you have questions or somebody else in the podcast or who's listening right now um you can go to the description in the podcast uh there we have a link prepared for you uh that you can actually answer uh ask your questions and we are happy to uh well to share it or just discuss it with experts from uh from around the world and um yeah I do want to mention because we are here with the Institute and you too we are offering personal mentorships to guide you on this journey how to assess clients how to develop your principles how to design a life you deserve how to design processes in your business so you can do the stuff you like and you don't have to take care of all the repetitive boring business stuff and then there's a magical part of unlocking your own powers and that's why are you a big fan of I always see your eyes twinkling when you talk about that the unique powers of somebody combining your own expertises and passions to create a unique product or service we can help people that we have a few places left in our personal mentorship so if people are interested please send me a DM or an email or whatever it's easy to find this I think online and I'm happy to talk about your uh your business and to help you uh further with that because we do have the most beautiful profession in the world but imagine what it is when you only work with premium paying awesome clients and you have smooth design projects it's even it's even better even better it's even better yeah the recording will be available tomorrow wonderful so uh yeah we can uh we can listen back uh what we said in this in this two hours for the people who join us who want to listen back we've got the tips and advices yeah two three uh we will create a um but the website the landing page for that as well as CC Institute of interimpact.com and then they can find you there they connect can connect with you further with your uh with your Institute because you're doing a great uh a great job with that so we want to encourage that that we have more people that can uh can include that coaching part into their entire design uh world because that's how you can reach the Beyond level beautiful thank you so much yes thank you thank you everybody who was joining us live yeah I hope to see you next time with another topic thank you so much bye everyone

thank you bye-bye stay here CC