EP 028 - Pretty Rooms vs. Authentic Spaces - with Maureen Calamia

Join me and Maureen Calamia, Feng Shui expert for a discussion on how designers can observe and work with the often unconscious connection between client's homes and their lives, through using metaphor. 

Maureen will share examples of metaphor that she has have experienced and we will discuss some ways for you to go beyond the visible. To tap into the invisible patterns that may be showing through.

Top 10 highlights:

1. Unlock Hidden Design Insights: Discover how to uncover hidden design insights by understanding the metaphors and stories behind your clients' choices.
2. The Soul of the Room: Learn about the "soul of the room" and how to connect with it to create more meaningful and balanced designs.
3. Emotional Impact: Explore the profound impact of personal relationships, memories, and emotions on interior design decisions.
4. Practical vs. Emotional: Find the perfect balance between practical design considerations and the emotional needs of your clients.
5. Metaphors in Design: Dive deep into the world of metaphors in interior design and feng shui, and how they shape the spaces we inhabit.
6. Visualization Exercise: Experience a simple visualization exercise to tap into the subconscious desires of your clients' homes.
7. Creating Empowering Spaces: Understand how to design spaces that empower and support your clients in their daily lives.
8. Beyond Aesthetics: Discover why interior design goes far beyond aesthetics and how it can impact every aspect of a person's well-being.
9. Transforming Homes: Learn how to help clients transform their homes into environments that tell their unique stories and aspirations.
10. Surprises in Design: Prepare to be amazed by the unexpected insights and transformations that metaphors and emotions can bring to your design projects

Get ready to take your interior design skills to a whole new level by tuning in to this insightful podcast conversation with Maureen!

Transcript

"I'm so glad you brought that up more because that's where the connection with the individual client matters because what are their goals what are their needs and their desires it it's all relative to the individual so there's not like oh if you have this it's this problem it's it may not be a problem it may be wonderful um and supportive so yes it is definitely um connected to the individual."

All right welcome to another inspiring episode of Beyond Interior Design a deep podcast that delves deep into the world of design and the profound impact of our surroundings on our well-being within entrepreneurial twist because here at the Institute of interior impacts we are a big fan of guarding you to the next level by providing you with the right two sets to experience absolute creative freedom and fulfillment to design a life you desire and deserve I'm your host Marc Müskens it's our design and business coach and today we have the privilege of Hosting our next remarkable guest Maureen Calamia. She's an experienced Workshop leader event speaker and author of the book creating luminous spaces and Marine's unique approach is rooted in the wisdom of Eastern philosophy particularly at the five elements of feng shui she inspires others connect with the true nature although the lens of design and the spaces we inhabit so today we explore what a fascinating world of design and the secret of ready rooms versus authentic spaces using metaphors yes he is Maureen Calamia. Hi Marc hi there welcome nice to be here thank you yeah welcome and welcome everybody who's joining us live here in the podcast we are we do have a chat you can use it but uh preferably uh you can ask your questions at the end of this uh episode you have the opportunity because you are joining us live so uh please uh do that if you want and then we're going to start um with it so um yeah pretty rooms versus authentic places well but first uh Maureen to complete to be completely honest with you thanks sweet

whatever it was a a high school project of mine when I was uh around well 12 years old we could choose to do an 80-hour project uh for your uh yeah George your uh yeah for the end of your school project and I was like let's let's do things with was kind of new then so I designed an uh apartment fully with it with all the elements and um it has great elements in it it's not my religion I think you are it's your religion but um it yeah like I said it has some great elements it's connecting with nature with with the universe so uh well you are the right person to continue my journey

yeah tell me more about it yeah yeah feng shui is is a remarkable uh practice that I um discovered in my late 30s and I've never looked back because what I have found in feng shui is really this very deep resonance with the natural world with the um really the kind of the underlying reality that we live in that is often masked in our modern world and it gave me the language for things that I really didn't understand how to explain but I knew to be true so it's just a love and a passion of mine yeah that's it that's well said yeah you you don't know how to explain because it's you cannot call it science yeah we talked about signs of design before there is some science elements that we know it's true okay because our heart tells us it's true our feelings our emotions so it has to be true but it it sounds kind of spiritual right so yeah so is it is it going to be a kind of spiritual episode or how do you

um yes in the way that it everything is all connected our spirituality can't be separated from our emotions from our psychology of how we view the world and how we live in the world so yeah it will be great I recognize your word about page uh if you weren't a feng shui consultant your dream job would be tell me um I think it was a storm chaser yes Storm Chaser yeah or an astronomer yes astronomer or storm chaser or meteorologist all all wrapped in into one um yeah I I definitely have a passion for the I guess the awe that the natural world provides so I really lean into experiences that give me that sense of awe the the the force of nature yeah yeah because yeah there must be a meaningful connection between yourself and the greater customers right right yeah we all uh yeah I think we all believe that but uh sometimes we really need to feel it to experience it fully otherwise we're in our hats again not in our hearts and we lose the connection and then well most of the time life goes uh it's going to be hard then when you're just in your head yeah I think those experiences of all kind of um kind of smack Us in the head a little bit like look at how amazing this world is and um and and understand our our role in it which is this big right yeah so it really kind of puts us in our place yeah let's go sometimes they call it the power of the subconscious yeah because that that's what impacts on us on a real level but we we don't always know the how and that's uh sometimes it's quite frustrating that we can can explain it but it's there we all know um pretty rooms versus authentic spaces what is what is authentic because it's a this word is well an overused word sometimes when when people talk about companies or Brands say you need to be authentic or you need to act authentic that's even worse acting an authentic I don't get that one but uh tell me what's what's authentic for you I think you know trying to put words to it because I feel it right we we feel when we hear the word authenticity or being authentic we feel it but it's hard to put the language around it I mean I think it's it's being who you are in a vulnerable state being open to who you truly are and I think in our modern times I think a lot of people haven't really explored that and are really starting to do that journey of exploration who am I without thinking of the constraints of our family that's putting us in a particular role or um or Society um understanding what our passions are understanding what our gifts are I mean I guess it's been definitely an exploration of mine since I was 12. so interesting that you brought up the age of 12 before but um I started studying astrology at 12 years old because I started having those existential questions who am I um why am I here what is this all about so yeah kind of like delving into really the our motivation our ambition our Drive in our lives and I I feel like we all have uh a mission in some way um so that's authenticity to me yeah well and so when we have a lot of in common about that because we we have our own Journeys we're continuously exploring all this kind of areas and then and then you are empowering other people to experience that because well we are enteral designers most of us are we are we have the power to design this world literally to design our environment to design our life our businesses we literally have the power to do that it's not a coincidence that things will uh will happen maybe so uh so what what about right now we if we talk about pretty rooms what what is the effect of pretty rooms is it something uh is the kind of frustration of yours or what what is the word pretty room mean to you

interior designer and I have no interest interior design really it's because um well

interior design has a very strong role and coupled with authenticity it is magical and I think that's what this podcast is all really about but spaces can be beautiful can be really pretty but if it's just someone else's um kind of vision for the room and it's not really

filling someone's soul I mean our homes are such a personal intimate space for us it is our sanctuary and if it's just a pretty room which is like a facade it's really not supporting the inhabitant of that space so um you know a lot of the trends kind of Decor Trends it really kind of gets to me because it it could be very good for some people but when it's just used kind of mass across the board like everyone's going to do this and everyone's going to do that why jump on that train um yeah yeah I guess that's a little bit of a soapbox yeah yeah well that's why that's why I invited you because you are not an interior designer although otherwise it was like you're you're in the you're preaching entire design and we're all back I never met an entire designer who is not passionate about entire design so in that case it's funny that you that you are as a kind of Outsider mentioning pretty rooms it's in a topic we talked about before in other episodes but uh yeah it is what is the purpose of an of a pretty room right it's maybe uh um it's a temporary room you would like to be or someone someone you would like to be and sometimes it works yeah it can stretch you to the to the next level in life if you have an environment that invites you to do uh the stuff you really would love to do it can be that but but when it's a facade when it's a surface when you're doing it for your ego or the outside world I think the energy is gone it doesn't work it's fake almost yeah and I think I think that could be another word for for pretty rooms sometimes they are they feel fake right not not real emotions yeah but um well I think times are changing in that in that field because of sustainability because of uh we need to do we need to act differently with the world and uh and not this uh not all these Trends uh chasing yeah so um yeah and and Mark I just wanted to interject that I think I think there is a great movement a great shift um in these last few years I mean definitely the pandemic has moved that accelerated that but I think people have been feeling this unease of just um needing shifts in their lives and and coming from more authentic space um one of the great Eco psychologists calls it the great the great um turning yeah on this planet and and I really am a proponent of that I really do think humankind is going through this great shift of um of kind of restoring that authenticity in our lives yeah a lot of people are craving that yeah and it's well the the most amazing effect of that side effect is that we value things differently and that I think that's the most wonderful thing here our philosophy uh well people that uh follow with uh are a big fan of the energy they know it form follows meaning and it's all based on that if it is if it has it hasn't got the meaning for you what what's the value of it to have things in your life or to live in the environment that you don't like or that you don't need or doesn't Empower you to do the things you love so um yeah wonderful so um what is the effect of an authentic Place space what's the effect on your life ah it's a place that you can call a sanctuary I think it it very much can support you um it is a place where you can you know really be yourself but also um can help you almost like a um a vision board I mean you know it's you know the law of attraction in a way although I'm not a big uh Law of Attraction person but it's like when you surround yourself with things that make you feel good make you feel um uh like you said you you have a love the things around you and it's just so surprising how many times I work with clients and I'll ask them about and it's like oh somebody gave me that uh you know and it's prominent in their home and I'm like how how can you you know yeah it's hard um when we when we just have things that are just oh well you know I went to the store and picked something up to fill that wall yes oh my God it should be something you love yeah yeah we had a client we got on one birthday she got three kind of cats kind of nice well stupid cats and then the next person was like oh she loves cats and now she ended up years later with her two closets with uh beyond the class with all cats well she kind of loved it now but she was like what what is it in her life so she just kept when we did the redesigned the house she just got the the five most beautiful cats to remind her of yes this feeling and emotion but for the rest he all gave it away or whatever but yeah sometimes it's kind of stupid she was so grateful I cannot throw it away but well hey it's in your life every day why you have this in your life yeah yeah it's a kind of uh declared approach a lot of people are doing that um we we do say we have a kind of uh we created a magazine for our prospects we send that before we go to the to the actual live meeting the first meeting or sales meeting you could call it and it's uh there was a love it needed diagram in it so if you love it and you need it it's a wonderful object to have in your life if you only need it well then sometimes it can be a really ugly thing like a washing machine or whatever you know you you make sure you have a pretty one or a pretty room for that and now pretty in a positive way so uh because you need that you need that washing machine or you need that object but when you love it and you need it well that's the the ultimate scenario so uh well there there's a big uh challenge for interro designers there to fix those things that we need and that are not pretty so uh yeah and that one and when you love it well make sure it comes for the if it's important for them you are the designer in my opinion so make it make it beautiful make sure although it's an ugly object you don't like it or it's not uh stylish or trendy use it try to use it that's you that's your expertise in the in my way so yeah that uh I I love authentic spaces you can feel it and at the end it should reflect the uh the homeowner and uh all I said all the activities so so how how do we know it's an authentic Place how do you know you can say well you everybody recognize a pretty room but how do you recognize an authentic room well how can you recognize an authentic room um uh well I mean be in your own space obviously like you said you're gonna feel good there um it's gonna be supportive to you um and there's going to be a lot of love surrounding you if you're an outsider in a room I guess it's you know seeing the ease of the person in the space and how they relate to their spaces um and um you know just simply asking some questions can help you understand like you know what's your favorite thing in this room or um you know where do you sit and and kind of see what their view is can be interesting like what are they looking at wherever they sit a good part of the time and um you know you can kind of start uh pulling things together to see it that it really feels good also you know in feng shui we work at a different level than of course interior designers because we get well from from what I understand interior designers also get the personal stories quite a bit so I can't say because I'm not one but as a feng shui practitioner people hire us to come in and it's we start with not oh what do you want this room to look like or what what do you want the function of this room to be what do you Vision it we're not talking about that we're talking about this the silver what's going on in your life what do you want to you know shift what would you like support on so we get the stories right away we get oh they just got divorced or they're an empty nester now they're looking for a new career or you know so they give us their personal stories and you know we we gently probe to get a little bit more detail um but um I don't know if you want to start talking about the metaphor yeah because yes you said yeah hey you just tell me I don't know what interior designers do functionality or Aesthetics but in my opinion good good Intel designers are they they go so much in depth they go to the soul of the clients they go to really what they want they go to they are chasing the question behind the question you know the the bigger why that's I think that's that's why we call the Institute of interior impacts because the environments hey you know that's we agree on that one in parameters the environment has such a big big impact on people's lives so he needs it you need to know what what is it that they want to change and uh this kind of relationship energies or uh uh stressful energies or whatever they bring home from the work or from other elements you can create a place for them to heal literally so uh yeah we agree on that one and yeah like you said you um you're using metaphors yeah you call it metaphors what what is a metaphor so a metaphor is really just something that is representing or symbolic of something else it is really the language of the subconscious mind and um I I really have um a great interest in the work of Carl Young Swiss psychologist a psychoanalyst and you know he talks about metaphor and symbolism that is in our dream world that is in our waking World um but also it's really fascinating that he gets into the psychology of our homes as well I mean he he had two different homes he had the one where it was you know polished and handsome um you know Antiques and Grand and that is what like really fed his ego of being this you know famous psychoanalyst and he would receive his um patients there and of course colleagues and stuff and then he had like 20 miles away on a lake he had his private retreat and and it was his inner soul is the way he talks about it and he realized that there's just this real difference between um say the facade yeah the outside world yeah or the the facade of the house and the facade of our psyche and then the inner right the inner house and then the inner psyche and he saw this like amazing metaphorical connection between you know our home and our psyche and it you know there there's just so many things that we can look at um was it there right you said Carl yeah yeah volume okay we will uh we will mention the name on your uh on the page we're creating for you uh Institute of [dairyimpact.com](http://dairyimpact.com "‌") Marine we'll be uh launched soon and we put the name there uh so people can uh yeah can look it up yeah so yeah the the inner world if you can crack or break down the facades that's the real beyond the terror design part we're always aiming for because there's a real value if you can get insights to this inner world or this secret retreat at the lake there's the real uh the real person yeah and then you can can um yeah you can try to break the faceta to or to change the facade right and what happens then when you do that

um what you mean me no when you when you break let's say you break down the facade of somebody of somebody you will you will make them uh conscious of these two worlds this inner world and the and the outside facade yes and and metaphor is a great way to illustrate this um because I think we all in a subconscious way we all get metaphor we all get symbolism so you know for specific uh examples I can certainly share um so one of my clients called me um it was regarding some you know I guess uh very common issues you know they wanted help with career you know maybe help with their children maybe romance a little bit I mean this is the language that my clients come to me with um and I was you know as soon as I walked in their home I saw that they had a staircase directly in front of the door and in feng shui that's like a big No-No you don't want the staircase right in front of the front door and I think a lot of people are aware of that even not feng shui people so you mean from the front door goes open and the in all the invitation goes up yes yes but but this front this staircase was completely different than most that I encounter it actually had no risers so it was open right openings all the way up and and that's another thing it's it's called shachi I mean we're not going to get into the feng shui of it but it's kind of like these points facing you as you enter but worse than that two more things that they were not done to code they were basically a regular staircase and they got rid of the Riser and that is not code because you could slip and your foot could fall and yeah I mean you break a leg easy right so they were too high but then also if you walked around the staircase to the basement was below it so you were seeing into their basement because that staircase was going down below it so you had two staircases yeah right there so it was like a disaster and I went but I don't act like that with a client I'll be like oh okay you know so we you walked around the home we we talked more in depth and what I uncovered in just conversations was that there was a lot of anxiety in the house um the two people in the household had anxiety off the charts they were on medication they had trouble sleeping it was very very stressful lives and um and this has been for a long time this is not just since they moved into the house but when I pointed out the staircase and just kind of walked them through literally like you know this is It's a novelty and the husband was like oh I love the house because of that stairs and it's like yeah it's a pretty stair it's pretty it's different it's definitely unique

said that their golden labrador retriever um was so um tentative going on those stairs because the dog itself knew it was not safe so I you know gave them a feng shui consultation and I said number one I'm recommending that you fill the risers back in the husband didn't want to do it the wife was like all right a year later they called me up still with issues and I said did you fix the stairs no my husband doesn't want to and I just said look there's really nothing more I can do right now that's it and uh you know just check into it so they did they wound up filling it in they were like oh my God we love it um it felt better yeah it's felt better safe comfortable yeah and and I'm not saying because they had anxiety and depression issues before they moved into this house so I'm not saying those stairs caused it I'm saying that there was a resonance between that anxiety energy and this home that they just married up um and and then it just continued um and any attempts at healing the anxiety were just um you know um blocked by the energy but I do hope the designer did a good job with filling up the stairs because I had to please the man because I think it can still be a pretty that's theirs that's what that's what I mean it's pretty is not a bad word but do it in the right way that it feels safe or comfortable or empowers the people that are living there or using it that's that's the that's the goal of the design right yeah if nobody feels safe there or they are not conscious of it yeah well yeah yeah this just simple stairs um I I I've there is always something with books and bookshelves when people have a big bookcase in their home it's kind of metaphor for me what is it what what does it do with people what does it tell me yeah it's like I I want to it's like we're kind of room reading right now it's like you are with a prospect you're entering the door and you see some some metaphors in their house some some big statements exactly what does it mean what what does the bookcase tell us you know it's those things it's those things that your eye goes to right away it's like oh oh can you tell me about this or you know you're just kind of observing mode um you know I had a client once when we walked in she had a really Grand foyer that was lined with built-in bookshelves that were jam-packed with books and it obviously a metaphor a very simple metaphor well it's not even a metaphor it's this person loves knowledge they love reading so um so you know she also had um other bookshelves in other rooms as well jam-packed with books so I just asked I said oh can you tell me a little bit about these books um so these are all your books wow and she was like oh no she goes a lot of them are my ex-husbands hmm talking about meaning and and okay that's fine but it wasn't even things that she cared about so it was it was fascinating and one of the reasons she asked me to come and help was because she kind of felt overwhelmed she felt like she could never carve out time for herself um she she just had all this stuff going on with multiple businesses and she was just overwhelmed and and a lot of anxiety too and exhausted yeah exhausted exhausted and what I pointed out that you know if you have no I mean it would have been different if they were her books and she loved them and they gave her a lot of um a lot of energy a lot of support but you know they didn't and I mean she had some of hers there too but I said to her like just get rid of those books you know donate them to the library I mean I'm not a proponent to throw things out in the garbage you know find find a place to to bring them someone else will enjoy them um and you know I I am not sure if she did but I'm hoping she did um just kind of open that space and that is another thing that is unique between what I do typically as a feng shui consultant as interior designer you see the end result because you work with your client the full way through a lot of times I go in it's just a one one shot and we work together and then I go and uh and you know so I sometimes don't get a follow-up and um sometimes I do but uh you know sometimes it's the frustration is really tiny I'm always decluttering my room and just as a kind of experiment uh uh so I see do I miss this or then I can I can put it back in my house or I just put it away for a while and I have the same with all my Cutlery we had a lot of knives and forks and every time when you uh take out the dishwasher you have to put it in your drawer and the drawer doesn't close because there is a spoon not in the right direction or whatever and it's just a small one but when I took half of the stuff away because you only need it when you have a party or what else yeah yeah I was every morning was like and the drawer closes I was like this is this is strange I never knew that I had this small frustration and it can be the same with the books when you have too many books and you didn't read them you can every time you can have the association like I don't have time enough every time when you see those books I don't have time enough to read them I don't have time to read them just put them away give them to somebody else and yeah don't put them away yeah they're coming back at you on the right moment in your life that's my story with books they're always people are mentioning books and then it's like oh maybe this is if if you find out somebody's talking to you three times about this book I'll think oh well I think universe will tell me something and maybe I need to read this book then it's the right time but not waiting on the shelf for the right moment that's frustrating yes I I story about a bookshelf

bookshelf a therapist in her office so she had an office in her home and she sat facing the window and the patient sat facing this bookshelf oh Shelf was again so packed where like there were things like on top of the books like every little space was jam-packed the shelf and I went oh my gosh the people that are coming there to unload to release it it's like they're blocked they're they they're it's it's just overwhelming energy in the shelf so again I was like get rid of half the books like you know really trim back make space make room for people to breathe yeah I I always have the uh when I do meet new clients I always meet them in their home in their habitats and um most of the time I don't get the best place I think a lot of people will recognize that you get the place for the visitors so they are with the back to the wall a safe environment and I want to see the whole room but I can't because they Place me with the back to the whole room and that's it's funny but you want them you want them to be comfortable and safe about talking about their plans and wishes so I don't want to I had to change their safe environment but it's funny it's the same with this uh yeah with this doctor yes yeah it can go uh really well great View and they start realizing the impact of the environment to their patients yeah you should give the best view to your client if you want to uh give them the right emotions and feeling of the environment yeah yeah um well yeah artwork is always in a kind of ego thing or it reminds of access as well relationships we uh recently had a project she said yeah it made me it makes me um

how do you say it looking looking uh with a kind of positive negative feeling to the past my language I don't know the sorry it's a kind of uh yeah I think some people will know the way but you have positive and negative feelings throughout the past and so it reminds you of that but then she said I said do you want to wake up with that and she said no I said why not you thought it was the most beautiful picture you had but then the energy was wrong so see yes strained from it when she was in a bad mood but we said now we're gonna pick a new artwork that reminds you of the future because we're creating your future environment your new lifestyle not with your ex-husband not with all the problems you had it's a new home yeah so you can literally use metaphors or symbol symbolics to empower them in the new uh in the new home so that's completely in line with your story and yeah back again to what you said about your language people are coming I did talk about you with their relationship maybe finances or health issues and most of the time those are the topics that are really hard for us to work with because we want to talk about the environment and the room and their lifestyle but then all these emotional things are involved and I think you really need to go really quickly to that kind of subjects with your clients to make it an easy one otherwise you will have a really long difficult trajectory with designing if all those emotions are involved right if they're looking for a for a partner and they are single right now it's definitely a topic to talk about to know what what this means for them would they like to invite a new relationship over there or yeah yeah you know it is an interesting phenomenon and I'm not sure if you've um and your listeners have um experienced this but you know a lot of my clients are single women and um sometimes they really would like a relationship but as I walk around I see images of single women in all their art and I thought how how strange why is that and then after working with several women in this capacity I realized that perhaps for some of them maybe they had a difficult breakup and when they finally found their independence they surrounded themselves with strong independent women yeah and and and that supported them and that was great for that period of their life but now exactly willing to have another that you know they're surrounded by the strong independent woman um so then it's like well you know what what kind of romantic images maybe do you want to bring in and you know um again yeah wrong wrong facade yeah yeah and uh what about the home office because sometimes in in pandemic we we squeezed ourselves into small corners and Dark Places and everywhere we could work something we had to with big families but what is it what does it say because you can be working alone but what what happens with your um I can't imagine it has effects on your mindset your working environment yeah absolutely uh I mean I work with clients um on their home offices of course pre-pandemic and even people with large homes that have an empty guest room or a guest room it's not empty that they could make a beautiful home office but yet they choose to keep it as a guest room or they squeeze themselves into the guest room and and it's like they're an afterthought and the guest bed is you know the you know the mean event um and then I I asked them oh you know how often do you use this room and it's just amazing how many it's like oh maybe once a year Well you you're making this room um for that one event a year let's let's move this around a little bit and it may not be the most pretty but like maybe let's move the bed into the corner and make your desk really the the main function of the room and give them a much more supportive space um you were talking about having your back to the room because you know a little bit about feng shui um that is like a big a really important thing is to be in a space with your back protected and having a full open view of the room and the door so um when I see clients usually in uh at a home office very often they've got the desk against the wall and they're facing a wall or maybe facing a window um and that's not good either facing a window no no okay well you're facing a window you're gonna have your back unprotected because you know it's not uh you you don't have a full viewer of the room but the other thing is it's it's well I think it's also the um glare of the sun outside isn't so great so that's kind of um a reasonable reason but it's like your Energy's out there it's not focused I do love when clients can move their desk perpendicular to a window because hey you know you can look out the window there and you can rest your eyes and you can see the beauty of hopefully there's nature outside um or even just having that sunlight even if you're in an urban environment and there's no you know real nature at least you've got the sunlight maybe the sky um but you want to be able to have a view of the door absolutely so so a metaphor this is unbelievable so I was with a client she says my husband keeps getting passed over for promotions he's he's an amazing worker he's so dedicated and loyal but you know he's told oh the next promotion will be his and they pass him over so I go to their home and I see his home office is this desk that's in their living room because they had a very small space which is fine um however it was a baby desk I'm talking about a desk for a five-year-old with a little chair for a five-year-old he put his laptop on that and he sat and it was his desk from when he was five years old and I was so blown away by the metaphor of of this desk and um yeah I mean just incredible and I just kind of explained and and they were just like wow uh wow didn't even it wasn't it you know didn't even occur to them of course um another client she had one what's the symbol of the desk then for him because I only can imagine playfulness I said uh positive Association a majority in the majority he wants to be a child he wants to act childless he wants to what what is the what is it that he wants or or that yeah I mean he he's stuck in the past um immaturity perhaps but he loves it he loves that does it support him or I I know but it was just like they had it and he used it yeah I mean you know we sometimes we can very um you know we can attribute it's just oh okay we'll use what we have and and I and I'm a proponent of that but you have to understand the metaphor of it and what your goals are yeah it's a year I see you're in the chat from uh Ava I'm not ready to take responsibility yeah could that be the one yeah good one yeah yeah I'm I you made me really curious with this guy now I want to meet a memory I want to know how how is ideal office would look like because I can imagine a lot of things that are beautiful of this childhood and this maybe it was more bold it maybe was more excited maybe once I don't know in a positive way but the other side what would happen if you designed this mature office right what will it do to them yeah and of course every every uh project is based on what you know is unique you know it's you know there's spacing and and I know they didn't have the ability to have a full home office and uh but they they were able to carve out a space for a regular desk the size of your desk does matter to to um kind of assert your confidence and your ability to take responsibility um uh to to grow so I mean if you're working on a tiny little desk and it's going to cause frustration um because you're not going to have enough space to lay out your stuff uh Converse side if you have like a a massive desk um maybe the ego's a little too big yeah you know it is always you feel yourself you feel yourself small and that's not what you want yeah yes yes and so it's balanced yeah and and or you have a very grandiose beliefs about yourself maybe a little over the top so it could be that too but it's it's fine yeah it could stretch your mindset though if it's if they are really conscious about it and you are designing an environment uh for your I think we we talked about it in the last episode with Kristoff if you design an environment for your future self in five years it can stretch you but then you are really conscious about it and you will make conscious natural decisions and then it's great then it's that's that's the goal that's the purpose that it has a meaning but not just for your ego right yes and that's where I'm so glad you brought that up Mark because that's where the connection with the individual client matters because what are their goals what are their needs and their desires it it's all relative to the individual so there's not like oh if you have this it's this problem it's it may not be a problem it may be wonderful um and supportive so yes it is definitely um connected to the individual so the the last part uh Maureen because how do how do we work with metaphors what how how can you start with it if you if you see a kind of metaphor or something that stands under the room what is it right so I I think you know we talked a little bit about this earlier but just to kind of pull it together it's yeah you know it's it's the act of observation which you know we all work with in interior design and feng shui it's observing the environment um I think it is important to kind of make a mental note of things that might seem a little odd like if the room is super super dark or if there's um oh here's another one really kind of crazy art all over the house I worked with one client and all the art was painted paintings it was really dark imagery dark colors and I walked around going oh uh I didn't like it but thank God I didn't inject any of my emotion I think um and just asked her curiously oh can you tell me about this art my assumption was that she was depressed you know like I was going crazy with all these ideas and she lit up and said it's my father's paintings he passed a few years ago I feel so much love having him surround me and I went oh great so yeah we have to be careful with our own assumptions about things in someone's home but um so asking why asking why ask sure things things are standing out there or awkward or or amazing or expensive or whatever ask the story behind this yeah and you want to know why tell me can you tell me something about this yeah you know um and leave it open like that and you know again you can get everything from I absolutely love it and there's great energy behind it too I hate this um but I have it there because I'm filling a gap in the on the wall you know you know with the artwork I can imagine that's what what we sometimes do with all this we did with this recent lady uh this in her apartment we collected all the artwork from the past I made one collection of it and then she could literally take a moments when she needs it when she needs to pass through her she wants to think about it she can go to that space But it was not a prominent space not that she could face the daily really easily she's when she wants to go she could go there and she loved it so you're not the same with this lady when she has all this artwork in the whole house spread over the whole house that's not the best way to deal with your father's death right yeah you need to move on but you you want to have this beautiful memory too so yeah yeah and and you know I again it's it's dealing with that unique client and I felt um I mean I might have been wrong but I felt like she was still grieving she still needed to go through this process and it was supportive to her a few years later if I went back and saw all that again I might have the conversation with her about um you know maybe like I would see how she's doing yeah you know yeah and then maybe make some recommendations to trim it back a little bit yeah yeah I I always love those skirty strange things ugly things I was like oh I want to know more this is this is the story there's the there's the key to the whole concept literally always always this stupid ugly fancy stupid funny thing that stands out I love that and when it's not when it stands out and it's not a story it's easily to get rid of it is that right just that why do you have it in your life does it support you right no we can get rid of it okay wonderful and gone and it's out of the light you will immediately make some major steps because you know it's it's a frustration or a energy lack or whatever yes and they already know it so uh yeah well wonderful yeah so it's all about wiser yeah absorbing observe ask questions in a very curious way a non-judgmental um seeing where that goes maybe probing a little bit if that is comfortable in the relationship and and how you work but also there is a cool little visualization that I do um and we can do it now if you want yes that's the kind of bonus of today yeah I love it when you talk about can we do a meditation and say yes of course I've got a visualization right yes it's a a brief meditation to uh connect with a deeper desires then you you call it the soul of the room yeah yeah the soul of the homes so um I I do I do very much believe that there's Consciousness in everything and I do feel a consciousness of of the home um and and I think many of you would agree that you know your home you've got a relationship with it I mean it's it's not a um inanimate entity I mean it is an entity it is a living soul I feel and I know that I had contact with this Soul when I first walked in here and that was way before I studied feng shui I was in marketing in New York city so um this home spoke to me yeah so so what I what I like to do um is is have my clients just kind of sit is it something that we can do with our clients if we feel comfortable with that absolutely yeah absolutely it this is just a simple simple little exercise and if you feel your clients are open to it because not everybody is not all of my clients really want to go there no so um so you have to say but but basically you just have them kind of sit straight in the chair comfortable and just ask them to close their eyes well we uh take a sir with you uh Maureen we are uh guide us we're all right so I'll lead you into it it's very simple so it would only be a minute so just close your eyes

and you can let your imagination go to where you feel the heart of your home is it may be a treasured object it may be a staircase might be a door might be the kitchen

whatever first comes to your mind just allow that to be the space you connect in it doesn't really matter

and when I say connect in just acknowledge it

and I'd like you to give some gratitude express some gratitude for for a few things in your home and what they mean to you

and then this is the part that really requires just an opening of the imagination allow yourself to sit now and be on the receiving end of whatever your home wants to share with you

it might be a request

it might be just some words of connection with you

and this is the part that can take a little time so I know we don't have 10 15 minutes but we want to just have a few more breaths in this space

and then you can just gently open your eyes and come back

and um

we can all do this it's just how willing are we to allow our imagination to not be taken over by our rational mind um you know there's been experiences of I saw a black door um my home wants me to paint the door black um or oh I got I got a call to the trees in the circle in my backyard and they want me to I see a fire pit there they want us to spend time there um so it's not just the structure but the land itself I a lot of my work is on the land itself not as a landscape designer or anything but it's more about a spiritual connection to the land and um anything can come out color uh words maybe you hear something that will spark some thought of oh I think it wants me to do this or it could just simply be a feeling of Love Back which is most beautiful of all wonderful Marine yeah I think it will uh Amaze a lot of people even when you're not spiritual or familiar with visualization meditation that your mind is always giving you a surprise it's it's popping up from the unconscious and I didn't know what was going to happen for sure and my house taught me something so it's it's wonderful I'm not going to share it because I want to keep everybody in the in the in the zone in their own Zone but it's it's wonderful I think if you are uh if you do have a good relationship and you can build it really easy with your clients when you are on the same page you know what you want to achieve with what kind of impact you want to create with the house if you talk very fast about the Beyond level of interior design that's what we promote that's our religion if you go to this Beyond level I think people can be really comfortable in just a short visualization because you saw it only take one two minutes and there is a new message to work with for people and uh yeah I I know some well for me there was the well kind of changes I would like to made in my house and I didn't know why exactly and now I got the reason so that's it's cool now you know why you want to do it and I never you can think about it really hard but the unconscious had the answer already so thank you for that Noreen special episodes it was literally a journey yeah when we went sideways in depth feng shui and the Primal feeling uh emotions metaphors but I really liked it because it this is the vague territory we have to uh yeah we have to write always as an entire designer all these emotions that are involved or these relationships and other energies in the room sometimes you don't know but it's really helpful to know what is really going on in the house and why we want to change it why we want to transform the house for the better yeah so um thank you Maureen you're welcome thank you for the journey thank you for everybody who was joining uh the life and of course for the people um who are listening on the on the podcast platforms Spotify Apple Play Google play whatever I hope to see you next time thank you very much