#052 - The Biggest Beyond Interior Design Lessons — Flashback Part 1 by Marc Müskens

After Episode 50, Marc Müskens realized he wasn’t done.

In this powerful follow-up, Marc revisits his biggest takeaways from dozens of conversations on Beyond Interior Design— from innovation and creativity to communication, serving high-end clients, and the evolving future of our beautiful profession.

This episode is a deep reflection on what truly defines the success recipe of tomorrow’s designer: purpose, courage, and curiosity.

You’ll hear lessons from previous episodes:
• #001 Yalin Tan — on designing the interior design firm of the future.
• #006 Kristoff DuBose — on the future of office design.
• #033 Cas Esbach (MVRDV) — on staying true to your creative DNA.
• #026 Kristoff D’Oria di Cirie and #038 Dawn Scott — on AI and human intuition.
• #003 Grant Dudson — on play and childlike curiosity.
• #034 Giovanna Castiglioni — on design principles as your creative religion.
• #004 Deborah de Jong — on communicating with your clients.
• #009 Tyler Suomala and #035 Gail Doby — on setting boundaries and communicating your value.
• #007 Lorena Gaxiola — on the art of property design and real estate.
• #029 Steve Griggs, #046 Jeffrey Shaw, and #047 Tanya Shively — on the real meaning of luxury.

A masterclass in connecting the dots between design, humanity, and growth.
Because when your why is clear, the how becomes effortless.

This episode is just the beginning.

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Transcript

Marc: [00:00:00] Hey, mark here. After episode 50, I realized I wasn't done. The reacts were so strong and honestly, and I had way more to share. So in this episode, I'm going back to my biggest takeaways from all those incredible conversations on the Beyond the podcast. Not just what I learned, but how it changed me. As a designer,

we got so many reactions on episode 50 that I felt I had to make another flashback, a deeper look back at all the previous episodes because yes, of course, every single episode make me think, act in design in a different way, continuously enriching my perspective. On this beautiful profession of ours, and that's why I choose to create another one.

And this time sharing the main insights I got from [00:01:00] speaking with all these amazing people who are willing to invest their time to share their knowledge with us here on the Beyond the T Podcast. And I know you may have had completely different insights while listening. That's how it works. Honestly.

Even when I listen back to my own interviews, I hear new things every time where focus goes, energy flows. But today I want to give you my biggest takeaways. Not just a quick list, but my real summary, my notes, my thoughts. Because here's the thing, when you listen to all these conversations, it can feel overwhelming.

So many ideas, so many perspectives, and sometimes it's hard to see how it all connects. And I know that feeling. That frustration of not yet knowing how, how to apply it, how to make it practical, how to turn inspiration into action. And that's why I wanted to do this reflection, to put it all together, to share the patterns I saw, [00:02:00] the lessons I keep hearing.

The moments that stayed with me because when you can connect the dots, suddenly the path forward becomes so much clearer. Well, here's what I've learned. When your why is clear, the how becomes so much easier. So let's dive in because I want to empty my head and my heart right now and share this with you.

I've naturally grouped all these insights into seven areas, seven sections. So let's go through them. Topic by topic. Enjoy Section one, innovation and the future of our profession. When I look back at all the Beyond the Terror Design Podcast episodes, one of the first themes that jumps out is innovation.

The way our profession is moving forward and sometimes faster than we even realize, and the first person that comes in mind is Ya and Tan, the founder [00:03:00] of. Done architecture with studios in London and Turkey. I spoke with him in the middle of the pandemic when so many of us were struggling just to keep things going.

But Yellen and his team were already building the architecture firm of the future. No longer the default of. Everyone in the office, nine to five, but forming the best team per project, pulling in experts from different fields, creating flexible multidisciplinary collaborations. That really struck me because it shows how growth and innovation are possible.

Even in times of crisis, and the Hower is simple but powerful, stop thinking of his studio as a fixed structure and start thinking of it as a network, a living system that can flex with each project. And then there was Christoph dubose from the uk, a workplace strategist who looks at the future of office design.

Now offices are not really my territory. I [00:04:00] mostly focus on residential, but just off completely opened my eyes, he showed me how you can literally read a company's virtual direction from the design of its workplace, where they lay out desks, meeting areas, social spaces, all of it reflects the culture, the moving toward.

And he introduced this idea of homing from work. And working from home brewing, the lines between domestic comfort and professional environments and the how is that office design isn't just functional. It's predictive. If you want to understand where a company your client is going, look at how to use the design space.

And that conversation, even me, even made me want to design an office myself, because now I feel like I know exactly how to do it. And if you're into office design. This is definitely an episode to listen to and to connect with Gustav Dubbo. And then there's M-V-R-D-V one of the most [00:05:00] renowned architecture firms in the world.

I spoke with Ka, who gave me an insight look at how they approach the most iconic projects. And what struck for me was the discipline it takes to stay true to your creative DNA and the pressure. Because when you're designing on that skill with the whole world, watching the temptation to compromise is huge.

But Gus showed me. How to keep going back to the core vision again and again no matter what obstacles come up. And how here is that all about process. Create a design vision early and use it as your compass. Every decision has to answer. To it. That's how they maintain such a clear signature, even across very different projects.

And although the skill of the projects is massive, but what made me really happy was hearing how much care they put [00:06:00] into the small moments the details users get to enjoy on a very human level. You don't see that in a portfolio photo, but in real life it's happening right in front of your eyes. So powerful.

And if you don't fully understand what I mean right now, you need to listen to Kaba from MV RDV, and of course, we can't talk about the future without talking about ai. My friend of the show and returning guest, Christophe Doci, uh, join me to explore our branding and tackle the big question we're all facing.

What does AI mean for us as designers later? Don Scott helped me to go even deeper into the conversation. I'll be honest, part of me was skeptical. Almost afraid. Should we be worried? Will AI replace us? But both Christophe and Dawn shifted my perspective. They thought me that AI is not a threat, but a tool, a creative accelerator.

The how is to [00:07:00] use it to push your ideas further, faster, and not to replace your creativity, but to expand it. And even more important is doubling down on what makes us human, our intuition, our. Emotional intelligence, our sense of beauty. These are the things no algorithm can touch a yet is the key.

Because new research shows AI is advancing at breakneck speed every 3.3 months. Its capacity doubles in just five years. That's a factor of 10,000. So tell me, what will our profession look like in five years? It's almost unimaginable, but it is what matters. We are the designers. It's up to us to feed AI the right input.

So it contributes positively to our society. And looking at Christophe Yen, cast from M-V-R-D-V and on together, the threat is clear. The future [00:08:00] of our profession is here. Flexible networks. Staying true to your own DNA. Embracing new tools while preserving what makes us human and the how isn't the secret.

It's in the daily choices we make. The culture we built in our studios and the courage to stay creative in a fast changing world. And a fun fact, the word courage comes from the French word, which means heart. So stay heart centered because ultimately we are the ones who feed ai.

Section two, play curiosity and creativity. Another theme that kept coming back in these conversations is play curiosity. The creative spark that sometimes gets buried under the deadlines, budgets, and expectations. One guest who reminded me of this so powerfully was Grand Zen from the uk, the creative director behind [00:09:00] how to Wow.

And Grant is someone who looks at the worlds with childlike wonder, and he reminded me and all of us, that design can be playful. We often take ourselves and our profession far too seriously. He said, we, artists and designers have an opportunity to change this world through our work, through creativity.

That brings that sense of childhood magic back and how he challeng us to deliberately step outside the lines to ask, what would the child in me do here? Can I add surprise? A moment of wonder? That shift in mindset is what keeps creativity alive. And besides being an interior designer and a mentor, I'm also a husband and a father, and my two boys are eight and 10 now.

But when they were younger, I still remember this moment so clearly I laid down under our kitchen table for the [00:10:00] very first time and suddenly. I saw my home from their perspective. From down there, the whole world space looked different. It was like discovering a new world inside my own house. And I actually suggest you to try it sometimes.

Just lie down on the floor, look up a see your home. In a way you've never seen it before. And then let me know how it changed the view literally. And then I had the chance to sit down with Giovanni Caste from Italy, from the Caste Foundation in Milan. She's the guardian of a fathers and Kos incredible design legacy.

And maybe the name Akila cast. Doesn't ring a bell right away, but is designed, certainly do. Think of the Arco lamp, the Stella stool, the playful meato stool pieces that are recognized and revert all over the world for the innovation and timeless appeal. [00:11:00] Still not sure. Picture that groom arch shaped floor lamp with a heavy marble base.

That's, and what struck with me was her ful energy and passion for principles. She said having a vision is not enough. If you don't communicate it clearly, it stays fake. Her words, you are the priest of your design religion. That's how seriously she takes it. The how she shares was simple but sharp. Write down your design principles.

Give them names, share them like commandments, and that's how you get clients and collaborators to understand not just what you design, but why. And then she told me something that stayed with me. The most valuable treat of a designer is curiosity after our talk. I even met her during Milan design week to visit her foundation.

And that same curiosity was everywhere. [00:12:00] So if you're ever in Milan, please take the time to visit the Ale Leoni Foundation. It's a a real creative laboratory, a place where you can feel the spirit of experimentation of play. And design thinking alive. And by visiting you not only inspire yourself, you are also helping to preserve this incredible design heritage, the Aquile Castella Foundation.

And then there was Joffrey Timmer, a Dutch entrepreneur and design thinker who always makes me reflect. He ask a question that hit deep. How relevant is design? Really? Why does what we do matter? How do we show value without shouting it? Geoffrey told me design is showing your most vulnerable site and certainly it clicked.

Why feedback and hurt us so much? Because when we share a design, we are really sharing ourselves. That's scary, but also [00:13:00] that's where the power is and the how is not to armor up, but to embrace that vulnerability. To see feedback not as an attack. But that's the moment where you can create the most meaningful difference for your client.

So between Grand Giovanni and Geoffrey, the message became clear. Creativity thrives when you dare to play. When you communicate your principles like a religion and when you stay vulnerable. The how is curiosity, openness, and again, the courage to let people in. That's not just design, that's being human.

Section three, A human behavior and communication. Another theme that really touched me across episodes was human behavior, because at the end of the day, design is not about furniture or walls, it's about people. And one of my favorite conversations was with. Deborah Deion from Australia, a [00:14:00] behavioral expert who coaches, leaders and entrepreneurs in reading people.

She gave us a whole new lens to look at our clients. How do you really communicate with someone sitting across from you? How do you uncover who they are beyond the words they say? And what blew me away was how even the tiniest signals can give it away. The way someone drinks the coffee, whether they're answer fast or pause, how do sit in their chair?

These are all clues to their decision making style and the how is to pay attention to these micro behaviors. One of the most powerful techniques is mirroring and matching. Try it mirror the posture, the rhythm, even the tone, and you'll find yourself on the same wavelength. It might feel at first, but trust me, no one will notice.

And when you try it, it's almost magical. You can feel what the other person is feeling. And we loved a lot that it's episode because suddenly [00:15:00] coffee became the ultimate design tool. Then there was June Giro, an American business consultant who has built her career on helping successful entrepreneurs get paid what they're worth.

You went straight for the tough spot Money, a topic many of us creatives try to avoid, but she flipped it in such a practical way. She said, stop treating your fees like a secret. You reveal at the end. Connect them directly to the transformation you bring. Don't sell hours. Sell ours. Sell impact. As you gave us a super concrete how.

Write one confident script about your value, practice it until it feels natural. And that way when the money talk comes, you don't stumble. You already own it. For many listeners, especially interior designers, there was a wake up call because if you don't communicate your value, who will, and that's exactly why we talk so much about adding your own beyond layer to your studio because that's how you raise your value.

You [00:16:00] already know there's more. You know you deserve better, and we are here to figure it out so you can attract the right clients and those truly amazing projects you've always wanted to do. The absolute awesome ones. Next up, Tyler Sub and Architects, who helps designers raise their perceived value and wow, did that hit the nerve?

We talked about why so many of us feel overworked and underpaid. Tyler's insight designers give too much, too early. We overdeliver in the hope of being light and it only leads to resentment. His how was simple, but game changing. Set clear boundaries at the start and use your portfolio, not as a gallery of pretty Pyxis, but as proof of your process, show how you think, not just what you make.

That's how you raise the perceived value of your work. Beautiful. Pyxis, not enough anymore. And then of course, Gil Doby from the United [00:17:00] States, a powerhouse in our industry with decades of experience coaching top interior designers. She didn't let me off easy. Gil asked the uncomfortable questions. What kind of entrepreneur are you?

What does growth even mean to you? Are you building a business or just running a project? Treadmill, what we call the design of rat race. Her how was sharp and necessary define growth, not just in revenue, but in alignment if your business isn't aligned with your life goals. The growth will ease your life.

It's so easy to chase more and more and more without asking more of what and for who. One thing I know, the quality of your life is determined by the quality of your questions. Remember that one. The quality of your life is determined by the quality of your questions. So from the borough, June, Tyler and Gail, the message is clear.

If you want to succeed as a designer, you have to understand humans, including [00:18:00] yourself. The how is observing, communicating, setting boundaries, and aligning your work with the life you actually want. And you are the designer, section four, property, a Real Estate and High-End Clients. Another theme that stood out was the world of property and high-end clients.

A world that can feel big and intimidating, but in the end. It always comes down to people, and one guest who blew me away was Lorena Gasa, a powwows woman in the tough real estate world. She joined me to talk about the art of property design and wow, what a perspective, because property on paper looks like numbers, investments, developers, but Laina brought it back to what really matters.

Who are the decision makers? What impact do you want to create? Are the stakeholders on the same page? Er, how was razor sharp? Don't just [00:19:00] design for the building. Design for the ecosystem of people behind it. And what stayed with me is their balance of beauty and strategy, because in the end, that building belongs to someone.

Someone lives there, works there, spend their time there. And that combination of beauty plus strategy. That's where the value is created. I truly appreciate how Lorena takes full responsibility as an architect and designer, because in the end, she's the one who draws both the first and the last line. Then there was Steve Griggs, a landscape designer from New York who works on massive projects from.

Full landscapes with rocks and waterfalls to exclusive rooftop terraces future. In Forbes Magazine, he deals with big budgets, big expectations, big egos, and yet he stays incredibly grounded. That contrast really struck me is how was refreshing. Stay down to earth, no matter the size of the project. [00:20:00] Don't let the skill or the glamor sweep you away.

Focus on delivering quality and trust and the rest follows. It was almost a masterclass in humility, even at the top of the game. Another game changer was Jeffrey Shaw, an author and business coach who focuses on understanding the mindset of the luxury clients or as you to call them affluent clients.

And he gave me a sentence I will never forget when money is not the issue. Anything else is. That's powerful because when people have resources, they're not comparing you on price. They're judging everything else. Your responsiveness, your process, your clarity, your ability to listen, quite unbelievable.

But guess what? Just two weeks later, we landed a major project on a scale we have never designed before. It went beyond our standard packages, and I'm pretty sure that my conversation with Jeffrey played a big role in [00:21:00] making it happen. Thank you, Jeff. And how he gave us was to design your business around that principle.

Don't think luxurious about gold plated everything. It's about reducing friction, about giving clients a sense of. Being truly cared for, and that's what creates loyalty. And then Tanya Shively and interior designer who thought me that wellness is the new luxury. She said, forget flashy. Today's high-end clients want the home.

As a safe bubble, a sanctuary, a plays to shut out noise of the world to recharge, to focus on health and sustainability. And how was practical integrate wellness features like air quality, non-toxic materials, natural light acoustic comforts. These are no longer extras. They are essentials in luxury living.

And she showed that wellness is not just a design trend, it's a life trend. So. What did I [00:22:00] take from Lorenna, Steve, Jeffrey, and Tanya, that high-end clients and property design are about more than money. They're about alignments, humility, anticipation, and wellbeing, and the how is being clear art about your strategy.

While never losing the human sight. That was part one of my flashback through the Beyond the Terra Design podcast, innovation, creativity, communication behind clients. So many lessons, so much inspiration, but I wasn't done yet because as powerful as those themes are, there's an evil, deeper layer, the one that connects us back to nature, to wellbeing, to ourselves as designers and as human beings.

And that's what I'll dive into in part two of this flashback.

If you Felt inspired by today's stories. Make sure you join me on the next episode where design [00:23:00] becomes not just beautiful but Madison. So make sure you hit the following button and put your notifications on and what would be even better leaves a five star review on Apple podcast. Thanks for listening, and if you can't wait.

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